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Sun, Aug. 2nd, 2009, 05:42 pm
the alternate universe where *everyone* survives to the 31st century
Recently, I was rereading the first trade of the Waid and Kitson version of the Legion of Super-Heroes, and I was distracted ( as I am wont) by how few CoC are in their vision. I wished I could have a book where the Legion was recast from a more inclusive future. And then it occurred to me that, well, maybe I could. If I wanted it enough.  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  . Notes:1. If you're curious about what I changed, click on any of the pages. It'll take you to an animated gif showing before and after. The gif's are smaller, so I'm not sure if everything will show up, but I can't be the only one currently struggling with her internet. (Bandwidth issues are also why the pages are so small. Hopefully they're still legible! If you want to see a bigger version of any, though, I can do that.) 2. It was important to me, if I was going to do this, it not end up simply as a book full of tanned Caucasians. So instead it, uh, ended up as a war on Barry Kitson's chins. Also, noses. I tried for subtle, but not, like *handwaves*, too subtle, so hopefully that turned out okay. It quickly became apparent I had no ability to draw African hair anything - or you'd have seen more kinky hair in there - but I did what I could otherwise. I figured I could get away with one (well, two: Ayla is a twin) Storm-style character design, but I wanted the Legionaires to have realistic hair and eye colours. (Though you may have noticed a few dark-skinned, pink-locked people running around in the background. This is a homage to Max Gibson! ...and also a total lazy cheat.) 3. One of my bigger concerns was that I'd not do justice to Lyle Norg's adorable-ness. (Priorities!) Turned out, I did not need to worry at *all*.  4. Dear Sunboy, we both know you were never my favourite, but there was no reason to be quite this uncooperative. Holy crap. Guys, I spent more time fighting with him than *everything else*. In fact, this could *still* probably benefit from more time fighting with him, but at this point I half-wish I had left him as one of my token white people; I don't care that it would have undermined the entire project, I don't even care*. *That is a lie.ETA: Deleted Scenes - if you're curious about characters who weren't in the issue. ETA2: There are more exciting adventures in Issue Two, Issue Three, and a Coda.
Mon, Aug. 3rd, 2009 01:01 am (UTC)
![[info]](http://l-stat.livejournal.com/img/userinfo.gif) caia_comica
Coolness! Although ultimately kind of sad, because of the Legion needing this much work. Mon, Aug. 3rd, 2009 01:20 am (UTC)
odditycollector
For the record, it probably wouldn't have been so much work by someone who knew what they were doing. *is ded. And self-pitying* For the other record, though, I agree with the point you are actually making! Mon, Aug. 3rd, 2009 01:11 am (UTC)
brown_betty
I see what you mean about the chins! I think they mostly worked out quite nicely, although there's a nose or two which I can tell you had some troubles with. Mon, Aug. 3rd, 2009 01:16 am (UTC)
odditycollector
Hah! If you can only tell one or two, I think that is a success! Mon, Aug. 3rd, 2009 01:30 am (UTC)
cereta
Oh, nifty! Mon, Aug. 3rd, 2009 02:05 am (UTC)
poisonivory
This was really impressive! But also made me sad. OH COMICS, WHY CAN'T YOU BE BETTER? Mon, Aug. 3rd, 2009 02:21 am (UTC)
odditycollector
Because remember when it was the 1960s? *Those* were the *days*. Mon, Aug. 3rd, 2009 04:37 am (UTC)
tashiro
I'm very much impressed, and I'm actually glad you did this. It was a nice change, I think. Mon, Aug. 3rd, 2009 07:31 am (UTC)
odditycollector
Thanks! It would be a nice change, yes. Mon, Aug. 3rd, 2009 06:35 am (UTC)
thefourthvine
Wow. This is awesome; thank you for doing it. And I'm so glad you included the gifs, because I was looking at these pages - remember, I don't know the book at all - thinking that it didn't look like you'd changed much at all, and then I clicked through and the whiteness in the originals was STUNNING. Your pages look like, you know, actual people - the other pages are indeed the Future of Infinite Whiteness. Mon, Aug. 3rd, 2009 07:56 am (UTC)
odditycollector
thinking that it didn't look like you'd changed much at all,Considering the nature of the project, this is a great compliment. the other pages are indeed the Future of Infinite Whiteness. Yeah, I... yeah. I don't know what to tell you. And this was the future as imagined by DC Comics in 2004. (They have since reverted to the version of the future imagined in the 1960s, back when that one black dude in the issue honestly? He was a white guy, too.) Mon, Aug. 3rd, 2009 08:22 am (UTC)
karenhealey
This is amazing - the whitey white future of the original looks even stranger in contrast. Mon, Aug. 3rd, 2009 08:34 am (UTC)
odditycollector
I am impressed it managed to keep your attention all the way through! There are some pages in there with *no white people at all*.
How much would I have to pay you monthly to do this again for this title, or another series of your choosing? Mon, Aug. 3rd, 2009 10:13 pm (UTC)
odditycollector
I saw the blog post you wrote about this and, wow. Thank you. It was iffy if I was going to post this publicly or not (I've been complaining to people about how my "drawer project" was eating up all my time) but seeing people's reactions to this, I'm glad I did. (And now I have something easy to point to for why the lsh pisses me off.) How much would I have to pay you monthly to do this again for this title, or another series of your choosing?Hee! OMG, I so need a break from photoshop right now. I might continue this later, though you are right that I'd need to be wary of legalities. I'm not very worried about having the one issue up, as it's a smallish part of the collected tpb and this is at heart a transformative/critique/reaction/f* you thing, but at some (near) point it's gotta be intent to distribute. Mon, Aug. 3rd, 2009 11:18 am (UTC)
plum177
I highly prefer your version of the comic. *♥* I'm so glad that you did take the time to do it, even though there's clearly something wrong given that it needed doing at all. Mon, Aug. 3rd, 2009 08:31 pm (UTC)
odditycollector
Of course you do! It is the version with the *even more adorable Lyle*! (I did not know such a thing was even possible, but apparently I have managed it!) there's clearly something wrongYes. I'm pretty sure it is a blend of "all our major properties were invented in the 1960s!" and "I, as a comics PTB, wish everything in comics to be exactly like when I was 12!" and then a bunch of less specialized racism also. Mon, Aug. 3rd, 2009 09:14 pm (UTC)
kaneko
This made me cry - thank you. Mon, Aug. 3rd, 2009 10:18 pm (UTC)
odditycollector
D: You're welcome. (I'm sorry.) Tue, Aug. 4th, 2009 06:25 am (UTC)
azarias
I've never read an issue of Legion, so this was my first view of the characters. It's weird looking at the gifs, now, because the first read-through set my idea of what the characters look like and what the world they move in looks like, and the difference in the gifs is jarring. Tue, Aug. 4th, 2009 09:29 pm (UTC)
odditycollector
This pleases me (regarding my accomplishments here) because, yes. Jarring. It *should* be. Edited at 2009-08-04 09:30 pm (UTC) Tue, Aug. 4th, 2009 10:28 am (UTC)
maschalismos
Dude, I haven't read comics in *years* at this point, and this still made me cry. Thank you. Tue, Aug. 4th, 2009 09:32 pm (UTC)
odditycollector
*hugs* Thanks for checking it out. Tue, Aug. 4th, 2009 04:10 pm (UTC)
petronelle
This is a gorgeous project. I'm so glad you didn't just do paint-by-numbers with them. The pre-editing pages look so strange to me now, and I own this darn TPB. Tue, Aug. 4th, 2009 09:28 pm (UTC)
odditycollector
Sounds like your TPB is broken, Petra. Are you sure no one's been at it with a white crayon? Wed, Aug. 5th, 2009 04:07 am (UTC)
norah
I did this with my kids' picture books a while back, but nowhere near so successfully. Awesome! Wed, Aug. 5th, 2009 05:27 am (UTC)
odditycollector
Thanks! It is amazing what an "Undo" button can do for your artistic skills. Wed, Aug. 5th, 2009 05:22 am (UTC)
wemblee
This is so fucking awesome. Also, the noses? The noses are amazing. Wed, Aug. 5th, 2009 05:52 am (UTC)
odditycollector
Thanks for that! There was, let us say, some nose related stress involved on the way. (Everyone needs to have their *own* nose! And also it needs to be an appropriate nose for whatever ethnicity I've vaguely assigned them! And also they need to be recognizable from panel to panel! And... look, once I was trying to doodle a nose in class, and lost social points with a project partner because she thought I was drawing a penis. Which gave me a flashback to elementary school, when pretty much the exact same thing happened except that time the girl ran and got the teacher (though I may have been was totally instigating that time).) Wed, Aug. 5th, 2009 06:59 am (UTC)
kyuuketsukirui
Wow, this is so neat! I'm not at all familiar with this comic, so like thefourthvine, I looked at the finished pages and couldn't figure out what you had done. It all looked totally natural (both in terms of the distribution of races/skin tones and the coloring). What a shock when I clicked on the gifs! O_o And totally aside from the "yay for making it less white"-ness, you made a lot of these people much better looking! XD I...am not a big fan of the jaws/chins/noses of doom that so many US comic characters have. I can only imagine how much work this must have taken, but thank you for doing it. I wish people with some authority in the comics industry could see this and get a wake-up call. Wed, Aug. 5th, 2009 04:41 pm (UTC)
odditycollector
It all looked totally natural (both in terms of the distribution of races/skin tones and the coloring). \o/ What a shock when I clicked on the gifs! O_o/o\ (I *think* that is the headdesk emoicon?) I...am not a big fan of the jaws/chins/noses of doom that so many US comic characters have.Yeah, me neither. I... tried for restraint as far as fixing *everybody* went, but "this doesn't look quite right. LESS CHIN TIME I GUESS!" sort of become a mantra. (And Kitson's are not even that bad compared to most!) I wish people with some authority in the comics industry could see this and get a wake-up call.I would love to believe I live in a world where that is a likely outcome. Wed, Aug. 5th, 2009 09:10 am (UTC)
shadowvalkyrie
Your future is definitely the one I'd rather live in. Wed, Aug. 5th, 2009 02:38 pm (UTC)
asknosecrets
This is absolutely amazing, and you rock for doing it. Wed, Aug. 5th, 2009 03:09 pm (UTC)
helsmeta
That's fantastic. (I too am a Legion fan from way back, and WHOO! You did great.) Also, yes, yay for retaining Lyle's adorableness (SQUEE), and I clicked on the deleted scenes and... seriously, Nura might actually be my favorite. She's gorgeous! Wed, Aug. 5th, 2009 04:53 pm (UTC)
odditycollector
YES NURA. I DO NOT EVEN KNOW HOW THAT HAPPENED, BUT APPARENTLY I HAVE DISCOVERED THE MAX ADORABLE SWITCH. I changed, like, her nose and some cheekbones and the colour settings and suddenly HELLS YES. Wed, Aug. 5th, 2009 04:38 pm (UTC)
inarticulate
I was linked to this, and I have to say-- you're amazing. ♥ Thank you for sharing this! Wed, Aug. 5th, 2009 06:07 pm (UTC)
odditycollector
Thank you! I am glad people are looking at it/ Wed, Aug. 5th, 2009 06:02 pm (UTC)
jpegasus
One more for the pile of people who thought your version looked totally natural, and was weirded out by going to see the White Horizon of the original gifs. I mean, just in general, people with differing facial structure, what a concept, eh, DC? Comics would be pretty cool, if they could be like this. [dreams] Wed, Aug. 5th, 2009 06:21 pm (UTC)
odditycollector
I mean, just in general, people with differing facial structure, what a concept, eh, DC?But that is *hard*! I mean, I barely managed it, and I pulled off a flying C- in that first year art elective I took one time. Wed, Aug. 5th, 2009 08:03 pm (UTC)
sockich
Your work is awesome but seeing it compared to the original like that is fucking disturbing. :| Wed, Aug. 5th, 2009 09:13 pm (UTC)
odditycollector
My work here, it is accomplished. Thu, Aug. 6th, 2009 01:06 am (UTC)
stigmatize
I was just linked to this, and I have to say- I read your version all the way through before clicking to see the originals, and wonderbreadness of everything weirded me out out. This was just awesome to look at, though. ♥ :) Tue, Aug. 11th, 2009 05:30 am (UTC)
odditycollector
wonderbreadness of everything weirded me out out.There is only ever one possible future, and it was designed in 1958. :\ Thanks for checking this out! Thu, Aug. 6th, 2009 02:18 am (UTC)
(Anonymous): Great idea!!
I came on this post while trying to find your fantastic response to Frank Miller's Wonder Woman cover from a few years back -- the one with the male hero crotchshots (I wanted to link it to one of the threads over at MajorSpoilers.com ).
This project is great! I was thinking a few days ago about how white the Legion continues to be. Not just white, but still overwhelmingly humanoid: we don't even get folks like Blok, Tellus, Quislet and Gates in the threeboot! Grrrrrrr.....
It's a difficult question: you add more folks with blue and green skin, and more non-humanoid characters -- where do you make room from more red, yellow, brown and black folks? It's almost as if they can improve racial diversity or species diversity but not both at the same time...
BTW, I think your art could go farther -- I didn't fully catch on that some of the characters were supposed to be from new races -- they do look more tan than ethnic.... (But I notice that in the comics Karate Kid often has that "is he supposed to be Asian" appearance as well....)
Keep up the good work! (And objectify some more male heroes while you're at it!) Thu, Aug. 6th, 2009 09:32 am (UTC)
odditycollector: Re: Great idea!!
Ah, Green Lantern's crotch, will there *ever* be an internet debate where you are not relevent? I hope not. Not just white, but still overwhelmingly humanoid: we don't even get folks like Blok, Tellus, Quislet and Gates in the threeboot! Grrrrrrr.....That their future is humanoid-centric may arguably be a failure of imagination, but that it is overwhelmingly white is a failure of *humanity*. These are not the same issue at all, and it is, to chose a polite euphemism, a "mistake" to conflate them. "red, yellow, brown and black folks" are actively, measurably injured by being told, over and over again by our culture, that there is no place for them or people like them in the bright future. *Real* red, yellow, brown and black folks. Real *people*. I find myself unmoved, morally, by the representation plight of green or blue or tentacled aliens in human media. They can *suck it up*, and if that means I'm a specieist, I can live with that. It's a difficult question:I do not feel so. It's almost as if they can improve racial diversityThey can't. Not when they are starting with a cast of a zillion white kids. At this point, the amount of character bloat you'd need to get the ratios *approaching* less insulting levels is unfeasible, and that is assuming you don't add any new white kids. Which. Even when the creative teams on Legion are *trying* they don't go so far as *that*. And I have no idea where they'd get the CoC in any case. The Legion universe - the bit characters and background extras in every 'boot I can recall - is just as overwhelmingly white as the core team. BTW, I think your art could go farther -- I didn't fully catch on that some of the characters were supposed to be from new races -- they do look more tan than ethnic.... (But I notice that in the comics Karate Kid often has that "is he supposed to be Asian" appearance as well....)It's a balance that I tried to be careful with. I didn't really want them to look "ethnic" - the last thing I wanted was to go too far and fall into racial caricature. So it may be I've left "room for interpretation", but my philosophy going in was that between this or this, the second one is better. Thu, Aug. 6th, 2009 11:06 pm (UTC)
liviapenn
This was fantastic. A great idea, and you executed it wonderfully. Tue, Aug. 11th, 2009 05:33 am (UTC)
odditycollector
Thanks! This is a future I'd much rather believe in. |
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